Curse

Yukito Kunisaki · Jul 20, 2005, 02:14 AM // 02:14

Chucked Frozen Burst for Ice Spikes from an old build.

R/E, maximum dmg output build.

goal: no conditions, no interruption, just raw damage output to the nth degree.

stats:

10+2 Marksmanship
9+1 Expertise
7+1 Beast Mastery
10 Water Magic

Penetrating Shot
Power Shot
Precision Shot
Dual Shot
Marksman's Wager {E}
Tiger's Fury
Ice Spikes
Conjure Frost

Every single skill in this build is geared toward that ultimate damage output some of us just want to do from a distance. A true sniper. I don't have 14 Expertise but with Marksman's Wager, it shouldn't be a problem. If my foe is intent on running and weaving from my arrows, Ice Spikes should let me land easy shots. That in turn is followed up by the 3 damage dealing shots and Marksman's Wager {E} keeps the shots coming. Tiger's Fury makes it do extra dmg by faster reload time and that's about it for this build.

Any ideas?

theclam · Jul 20, 2005, 02:25 AM // 02:25

Here's an idea:

Switch Beast Mastery into Wilderness Survival. Switch out Marksman's Wager for Poison Arrow (it adds 40 damage at lvl0 Wilderness Survival and it only costs 5 energy). Switch out Tiger's Fury for Kindle Arrows, since you've already got Dual Shot.

Kishin · Jul 20, 2005, 02:41 AM // 02:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by theclam

Here's an idea:

Switch Beast Mastery into Wilderness Survival. Switch out Marksman's Wager for Poison Arrow (it adds 40 damage at lvl0 Wilderness Survival and it only costs 5 energy). Switch out Tiger's Fury for Kindle Arrows, since you've already got Dual Shot.

Never switch out Tiger's Fury in a damage build. It's the best attack speed buff out there. Furthermore, if he uses Kindle Arrows, it changes the elemental damage type of his bow to Fire, and that means he can't use Conjure Frost.

Pin Down is much less energy intensive and quicker than Ice Spikes, so I'd probably use that to conserve energy. Ice Spikes is slightly harder to remove, given that it becomes a hex, and slows an opponent down more significantly, but for a much shorter period of time. Either way, I'm still leaning toward Pin Down.

I'd boot Power and Precision Shot as well. One for Rez Signet, the other for Throw Dirt so you can at least protect yourself and your teammate. This won't impact your damage output too much, and neither of those skills are very good anyway. I'd fiddle around with your stats a bit so that you wouldn't need Marksman's Wager (Something like 10+4 Expertise, 9 Water, and 10+1 Marks and 7+1 BM, or 11+1 Marks and 3+1 BM, depending.) As far as a replacement elite.....you're not stacking Kindle on there, so you may as well take Barrage for spammable damage output.

Its not a bad idea, but its really not as good/efficient as the absolute maximum in single target conjure damage potential, which is Kindle Arrows + Conjure Flame (And you don't need a fiery bowstring for this combo, since Kindle turns your damage into fire) and Dual Shot, followed closely by Penetrating attack. I'm sorry if my suggestion turns your original idea into an established build.

Yukito Kunisaki · Jul 20, 2005, 07:13 PM // 19:13

Ice spikes nails a mob, but pin down lasts longer vs. one enemy...
Hmm. Throw dirt? I need a get away skill. Well, I like Marksman's and in terms of bow shots that deal damage, those are the ones I've come up with. Dual Shot + conjure + marksmans is lots of energy gain and dmg.

let's see changing:

stats: same

Pin Down
Penetrating Shot
Power Shot
Precision Shot
Dual Shot
Tiger's Fury
Marksman's Wager {E}
Conjure Frost

Well, Conjure is the major dmg buffer from the Ele line and the rest of the skills are affected by Expertise. I don't want to lose any hp despite the fact I'm so far away from my enemies so I don't want or need major/sup runes. 3 stats that are next to or on natural max is fine by me.

4 of my skills deal extra damage to my arrows. I think that's the max dmg I'm looking for. Fury for that faster output and Pin Down for no escape.

I don't want defensive skills. That kind of denys the idea of 'maximum damage'. Another idea:

Hunter's Shot
Determined Shot
Penetrating Shot
Crippling Shot {E}
Dual Shot
Read the Wind
Tiger's Fury
Conjure Frost

Not sure if it'd work though, just do Read the Wind and let the extra damage pile up. Dual Shot + Read the Wind + Conjure Frost + Tiger's Fury = a LOT of damage stacked I hope. Put in some extra cheap dmg shots energy-wise to keep that energy nice and high while still crippling my foes.

I'm using a max dmg icey stormbow of marksmanship and druid's armor.

Enigmatics · Jul 20, 2005, 08:39 PM // 20:39

I'm pretty sure a quick shot build will spike better against casters (dps, rather), though I can't tell if this works better on targets with higher armor class.

Kishin · Jul 20, 2005, 11:09 PM // 23:09

Good point on the Throw Dirt. I was in an Arena mindset at the time (Grr, that's something I'm not pleased with), so you can cheerfully ditch it. I'm still not a fan of Marksman's, especially if someone blinds you when its up. Crippling Shot is actually not bad in this build.

Read the Wind is kind of a poor man's Favorable Winds, but if you want a damage buff, go for it, and its certainly faster than the spirit (albeit it has a dismal duration). Its still almost better to do Conjure Flame + Kindle.

And Enigmatics makes a good point about Quick Shot. Actually, this will still work decently on high armor targets since the elemental damage will get past a Warriors hefty bonus to physical defense. Rangers will be a problem though.

Also, and this is important: DITCH THE STORM BOW. They're really not all they're cracked up to be, because they're too damn slow. Get a Short bow or a Half Moon for maximum firing speed and thereby damage potential.

Enigmatics · Jul 20, 2005, 11:24 PM // 23:24

Need I remind you the point of long range bows? However, storm bows do seem rather self-contradicting in this build, since the emphasis is raw damage.

Kishin · Jul 21, 2005, 04:13 AM // 04:13

What exactly do you need the extra range for? To protect yourself? You're a Ranger, nobody's attacking you until the fight's already wrapped up. If someone's getting too far away from you, snare them with your primary weapon, or keep that long range bow in your secondary slot and only switch to it to snare them on the run. However, you're not going to hit a moving target as well with a bow with an arced trajectory.

And yes, there's absolutely no point in a damage build to use anything other than a Short Bow/Half Moon. Horn/Ivory/Shadow Bows have innate armor penetration and would help deal larger individual spikes, but maximum damage over the least amount of time is the province of Short Bows.

Vulneraria · Jul 21, 2005, 03:05 PM // 15:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kishin

Horn/Ivory/Shadow Bows have innate armor penetration and would help deal larger individual spikes, but maximum damage over the least amount of time is the province of Short Bows.

??????????

what kind of armor penetration??????? in all the shot???? 10%? 20%?

shadow have the same fire/flight rate/time of short bow...or very very similar.

and why is not in the description of bow? are u sure?

Miao.

Yukito Kunisaki · Jul 21, 2005, 06:54 PM // 18:54

I was unaware certain bows had armor penetration built into it. And the advice on Marksman's Wager {E} becoming useless when blinded is being taken into account now. Must not be blinded, cursed blinding flash...

Very nice inputs people

Slow enemy down for easy hits to feed marksman's
re-analyze!

stats again: 9+1 expertise, 10+2 marksmanship, 7+1 beast mastery, 10 water

Pin Down
Penetrating Shot
Precision Shot
Dual Shot
Marksman's Wager {E}
Tiger's Fury
Antidote Signet
Conjure Frost

Well, no blind to negate Marksman's here. Damn air eles. Stance for power, preparation for energy vaccuum, and 3 hard hitting spammable arrow attacks. No way to escape when Pin Down hits. A full role playing sniper.

Kishin · Jul 21, 2005, 07:00 PM // 19:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vulneraria

??????????

what kind of armor penetration??????? in all the shot???? 10%? 20%?

shadow have the same fire/flight rate/time of short bow...or very very similar.

and why is not in the description of bow? are u sure?

Miao.

Its a flat 10%, and has been pointed out by several sources.

Shadow Bows are a lot slower than Short Bows. The Missile Weapons Guide here lists them as this: Shadow Bow 2.7 seconds 80' 0.75 seconds

WHich is the same speed as an Ivory Bow (I always equivocated them with Horn Bows) in my mind, and both Ivory and Horn Bows have the armor penetration.

I'm still not that big a fan of them, or Storm or Eternal Bows. They're entirely vanity weapons, IMO.

Yukito Kunisaki · Jul 21, 2005, 07:06 PM // 19:06

Well, short bows true, they do have a fast shot reload as do flatbows. But both have weaknesses as well. Flatbow has very nice range but unless my target is being tanked by something, not very smart idea. Shortbow contradicts the sniper motif.

Stormbow I will admit just looks good and it shoots on the slower end, however, Tiger's Fury should make up for it and it still has a rather straight trajectory when compared to the flatbow.

Kishin · Jul 21, 2005, 09:20 PM // 21:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yukito Kunisaki

Well, short bows true, they do have a fast shot reload as do flatbows. But both have weaknesses as well. Flatbow has very nice range but unless my target is being tanked by something, not very smart idea. Shortbow contradicts the sniper motif.

Stormbow I will admit just looks good and it shoots on the slower end, however, Tiger's Fury should make up for it and it still has a rather straight trajectory when compared to the flatbow.

No offense, but I really don't see the point of the extra bow range and the 'sniper motif', apart from being 'cool' rather than 'efficient'. Why exactly do you need to be farther away from your opponents? It's not helping you in any way, shape or form in PvP, and all its doing in PvE is protecting you mildly better at a significant cost to damage. Sure, a Longbow with TF isn't bad, but a Shortbow with TF absolutely blows it away, and using anything but the fastest bow in a damage build is basically gimping yourself.

theclam · Jul 21, 2005, 09:41 PM // 21:41

Since mobs don't move much in PvE, long range bows aren't bad. Flatbows have the same RoF as Shortbows, but much longer range. In some places they offer a significant advantage in pulling.

rii · Jul 21, 2005, 09:51 PM // 21:51

Surely:

Quick Shot [E]
Judges Insight
Tigers Fury

is all you need
???
never tried it though.

Kishin · Jul 21, 2005, 11:17 PM // 23:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by theclam

Since mobs don't move much in PvE, long range bows aren't bad. Flatbows have the same RoF as Shortbows, but much longer range. In some places they offer a significant advantage in pulling.

I should have mentioned pulling. I only ever use long range bows in PvP for that purpose. True a flatbow is almost as fast as a short bow, but the trajectory is ridiculously high. It will miss any mob charging forward almost certainly. But for stationary targets, its not terrible. I still prefer the shorter, direct path of the short bow trajectory.

But again, for pure damage, only the fastest bow will do.

carnivore · Jul 22, 2005, 12:53 AM // 00:53

i have a R/W thats geared very much to the same goals as ur ranger

and i agree that i hardly ever have to get hit while im out in a party

so to optimize my damage i go with kindle arrows(before fight)>poison>dual>hunte>dual>hunter...repeat until finished

but the warrior part comes in with just 1 skill. frenzy =D. now i admit its not better than tigers fury, but tigers fury requires beast mastery, me being a pure marks/expertise/survival ranger, and takes time to reload and cast. frenzy casts instantly, recharges before it runs out so i can keep it going. right now it costs 3 energy for me.

Yukito Kunisaki · Jul 22, 2005, 10:17 PM // 22:17

Problem with R/W is that no elemental dmg. Unless you're just using an ele bow for the heck of it, but then your arrows and skills may end up contradicting each other.

Conjure Flame + Kindle doesn't work on half war.

But you're damage is still hot from what I can imagine. And with teammates, it's the best way to go.

We all play with teammates and no build was designed to work totally alone, but I want my sniper to do just that. Deliver immense amounts of damage from as high and as far away from enemy rangers and enemy casters as possible.

shortbow may do more damage then me truely, and I won't argue with that. But if I can out range a busy shortbow user, hey, I'm happy.

I do have a shortbow though. Just for kicks. I don't like being close to my foes with a bow.

If I wanted THE maximum dmg per shot, I guess going Read the Wind with Tiger's Fury and Crippling Shot {E} for my elite could be best.

OneArmedScissor · Jul 23, 2005, 01:37 AM // 01:37

Just to reitterate something:

Res signet is a MUST for EVERY PvP character; regardless of class.

ICURADik · Jul 23, 2005, 01:54 AM // 01:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by OneArmedScissor

Just to reitterate something:

Res signet is a MUST for EVERY PvP character; regardless of class.

Nah. Monks shouldn't carry res sig. If they are wasting time ressing, then more people will die.